


Meta Archive

by Esahc, NellyNee



Category: Homestuck
Genre: Gen, Meta, tumbldown backup, tumblr post archive
Language: English
Status: Completed
Published: 2018-12-06
Updated: 2018-12-06
Packaged: 2019-09-13 04:49:30
Rating: Not Rated
Warnings: Creator Chose Not To Use Archive Warnings
Chapters: 6
Words: 5,668
Publisher: archiveofourown.org
Story URL: https://archiveofourown.org/works/16885917
Author URL: https://archiveofourown.org/users/Esahc/pseuds/Esahc, https://archiveofourown.org/users/NellyNee/pseuds/NellyNee
Summary: Backing up my meta threads from Tumblr for safekeeping





	1. Sign in Worldbuilding

**Summary for the Chapter:**

> Short discussion on sign language in worldbuilding, and dancing bees

TechnicalChaotic Posted:

Actually while I’m thinking about it and too sleepy to anxious myself out of asking.

Does anyone have an opinion about sign used in worldbulding? Because I think it’s the coolest fucking thing and kinda wanna incorporate it into that adopted-karkat thing I’m kinda poking at, but I am perpetually wary of borrowing aspects of real-world cultures.

* * *

 

 

nellynee answered your question “Actually while I’m thinking about it and too sleepy to anxious myself…”

      I can’t answer for sign culture, but I just want to throw in here some really interesting connections my brain is making with real life clowns and pantomime, together with insect movement based language (i.e. bees)

* * *

 

 

TechnicalChaotic Posted:

!!!!

I read this at like 4AM but didn’t have enough brain to respond, but I  _can’t believe_  I forgot bees communicate by dancing! definitely have to keep that in mind thank

 

 


	2. Sign in Worldbuilding

**Summary for the Chapter:**

> Talking about Gamkardave in variously smeared quadrants

nellynee asked

 

About the gamkardave post you just reblogged. Have you considered Ashen gamkardave? Like, alone together those two would rip each other apart in their social ineptitude but with Karkat to sooth out their edges they are actual functional and happy to share a space? the feelings of mutual respect and annoyance are they're they just have like NEGATIVE RESTRAINT. Bonuses for Karkat flailing over having to concupecent quadrant flip with gamzee and gam is just like.."Y not both?" like hello KINKY?

 

* * *

 

I HAVE ABSOLUTELY CONSIDERED ASHEN GAMKARDAVE

oops I wrote a novel under the cut

I mean, yes hello give me this. I still stand by the idea that while Dave can be cruel, he’s not a malicious kid, but (this might be me projecting my own family dynamic on him) he didn’t grow up with ‘gentleness as affection’ being a concept available to him, and ‘varying degrees of roasting as affection’ isn’t something I think would be healthy for Gamzee to deal with at the point in his life I would most like him to have as many people who love him as possible. 

Gamzee meanwhile has roughly 0% idea what ‘setting healthy boundaries’ means, and -500% idea what ‘removing himself from a bad situation’ means, and Karkat by himself is just. A massive shithead. Good intentions, good kid, needs work. 

But I can see Dave being able to recognize  _from the outside_  what ‘this interaction is harmful to this person’ looks like and being especially sensitive to the kind of berating and demeaning language Karkat’s prone to using while  _also_  being assertive/present enough to call Karkat on his shit, as long as that shit is directed at someone who isn’t Dave. Going the other way, I can see Karkat enthusiastically herding those two particular cats into something roughly resembling a healthy relationship by virtue of also being able to recognize shitty behavior that’s not coming  _from_  him. 

Karkat between them, not particularly good at people, but with Dave to trip him up when he’s getting ahead of himself, Dave, who needs constant reassurance from all his friends that they think he’s cool/likable, and isn’t going to just get distracted by something shiny  ~~like a pretty girl~~  and forget to check in on Gamzee. Because it’s important to him that Gamzee’s invested in him. Gamzee, who’s starved for any attention at all, who I truly and honestly believe would be better at taking care of other people than he is about taking care of himself (aren’t we all?), but I can’t see him, once he’s learned to defend himself emotionally, allowing the kind of bullshit teenage boys throw at each other, and lets all be honest here, Dave’s not getting in any relationship with any troll without mixing a little pitch in there. ~~(I also don’t think Gamzee’s going to be able to do a pitch relationship without flush mixed in, the kid just needs so much love.)~~

That was a lot of rambling tangle to say I ship it like fucking amazon, Dave, Gamzee, Karkat in some kind of ash/pitch-flush/pale clusterfuck where everyone somehow ends up emotionally cared for and satisfied with the arrangement, with the exception of Karkat who every week or so remembers he’s living in sin and gets the vapors. 

 

* * *

nellynee asked

(separate thought on ashen GamKarDave. Gamzee, with his really specific and intense kinds of flirting, is actually way more freaked out over (CONCILITORY) quadrant flipping with Karkat and loosing his moirail than Karkat "I have issues with determining between red and black feelings in my concupiscent quadrants why not these ones too also I gorge myself on media which probably holds an unrealistic and kinky standard" Vantas. Dave fucking hates quadrants.

* * *

cut to save dashes~

Oh man this is my favorite thing tho bc if you take it with Gamkar predating everything else then you get this super awesome dramatic bullshit with nobody talking to eachother for like three days (and okay I might have some old pre-A7 species swap fic floating around somewhere with some pitch gamdave) but my favorite thing is Karkat-as-Gamzee’s lodestone. 

Like, he could function without Karkat but he doesn’t know he could and he doesn’t want to anyway, and the prospect of losing Karkat (Esp over Dave of all people, bc even if it started pitch it wouldn’t stay that way, Dave’s too human and Gamzee’s too desperate for positive attention, and if Davekat predates the gamdave then it turns into this whole  _thing._  Because Karkat is at once this stabilizing force and this driving motivation (someday someone needs to ask me about Karkat needing Gamzee as much as Gamzee needs Karkat bc it’s not as obvious but it’s there) And the prospect of losing that would be  _terrifying._

Like Karkat’s freaking out about doing-this-wrong but Gamzee’s freaking out about losing-all-I-love and it takes Karkat a stupid amount of time(or maybe it’s more fun for Dave to figure it out first?  ~~I try to avoid the strider sadstuck here but i feel like he’d be familiar with hiding-bc emotions~~ ) to figure out that hide-and-silence isn’t a rejection-thing, it’s a Gamzee-freaking-the-fuck-out thing, and tracking him down and then just like, gratuitous reassurance and care. And the three of them working it out in the end, because lbh Dave needs enough pale for two trolls to handle and I feel like Gamzee needs someone to need him more obviously than Karkat can sometimes. 

 

_# NELLYNEE # KARKAT NEEDS GAMZEE OFC # BUT HE'S 98% BLUSTER # AND DAVE IS A NEEDY LITTLE SHIT # AS MUCH AS HE WANTS TO HIDE IT HE WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO FOR LONG # AND LETS JUST TAKE A MOMENT AND THINK ABOUT GAMZEE JUST /KNOWING/ HIS PALEMATES # THE SUBTLE CHANGES IN DAVE'S EXPRESSION BECOMING LESS SUBTLE AS HE RELAXES AROUND THEM # KNOWING WHICH THINGS KARKAT MEANS AND WHICH THINGS HE DOESN'T # LEARNING HOW TO EXPRESS WHEN THINGS HAVE HURT HIM # THEM LEARNING HOW TO NOT HURT HIM EVEN WHEN HE CAN'T SAY_  


 


	3. Clown Church Thoughts

**Summary for the Chapter:**

> Brief thoughts on potential clown church conflict

nellynee asked

 

*raises hand* PICK ME PICK ME! Ok fun clown exploration! Ummmm. Like there's a million ways to work out the church but I like a split church and I've never seen it? I saw something like it like... once? But like, two factions that both heavily deify their respective messiah. I'd go into detail about how this reflects their factions views on quadrants, death, and merriment but I'm out of room but open for discussion?

* * *

 

Oh man, so my favorite way to do that is a cohesive church, where the most devout clowns dedicate themselves to one or the other messiah (like a patron saint but More.) and strive to attain the ideal ‘virtue’ of their respective god. 

Caliborn is definitely the god of Life, though, and Calliope is the goddess of death (this makes the Handmaid confusing tho, maybe she steals souls from callie for Caliborn? Reasons???)  

Dedicates of Caliborn would be a model alternian troll with the violence turned up to 11. These are the hair-trigger, scarification, ‘kill all the heretics’ clowns. The bulk of the Church army, the first thing most trolls think about if they think about clowns. Their art is largely abstract with vivid colors and angular, geometric forms, performances of strength or especially dangerous stunts. They probably publicly disavow any quadrant but pitch. (get one in a pile they probably fall to pieces hmmm)

Calliope’s dedicates are less hyperaggressive, the emphasis falls more on family and caring for family. the lusus-trolls and minder-trolls are almost always dedicates of Calliope. Their art tends to the figural, or longer, less dangerous performances meant to be seen as beautiful or amazing rather than potentially deadly. 

This turned into a HoM headcanon oops. 

At some point I need to think about separate, warring clans of cal v callie dedicates because two seperate churches that violently hate eachother would be so much fun too


	4. How Karkat Needs Gamzee

**Summary for the Chapter:**

> Character Meta on Karkat and Gamzee needing eachother

nellynee asked

 

This is- this is me, asking, about Karkat and how he needs Gamzee as much as Gamzee needs him. This is asking right here there is asking happening I'm not blushing you're blushing.

* * *

 

I’m trying to stick to canon as much as possible with this one, which is kind of limiting, but suffice to say in the realm of fanon, Gamzee is a little shit who balances Karkat’s screechy self-loathing, and Karkat is a loving steamroller that keeps Gamzee moving when it would be much nicer to just lie down for a few million years.

 

Okay so we all know why Gamzee needs Karkat. He’s pretty alone, isolated, I don’t remember if it’s canon or fanon that he doesn’t take care of himself, but honestly he pings me as Depressed at the very least; the creeping stealthy kind of depression that manifests as apathy and executive dysfunction and spacing out at regular intervals, and Karkat, once he’s got his head screwed on straight, cares  _so fucking much_ , and he’s not graceful about it at all, but sometimes what you need is someone who is going to grimly drag you out of bed and shove you in a cold shower and yell angrily positive affirmations at you over slightly-burned eggs. It’s not  _nice,_ It doesn’t fix the problem, but it’s what’s necessary some days.

 

Now Karkat is a  _whole_  different ball of brainfail. 

My anxious little crab child. So full of fear and self-loathing and terror. He’s just as fucking needy as Dave is, but he’s even less subtle about it and more of an asshole about it. He needs to be needed, first of all, but that’s a cop-out for ‘why Karkat needs Gamzee’

He needs someone who gives a shit about him and will continue giving a shit about him, and Gamzee, with his lack of social graces and unabashed affection is exactly what he needs there (Someone write me Gamzee giving Karkat progressively soppier terms of endearment until Karkat passes out from the embarrassment.) He needs someone to balance his temper and reassure him everything’s okay, and he is essentially [the high-strung racehorse to Gamzee’s baby goat](https://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=http%3A%2F%2Farticles.chicagotribune.com%2F1996-08-01%2Fnews%2F9608010109_1_goat-horse-high-strung-thoroughbreds&t=YTE5YzlhNWZlOTQyNjA1ZDVlZmY5YTdmYzg0OGJlZDNiYmI3NmViMSxORXlvcDd4bQ%3D%3D&b=t%3A1ZZ53mQQ-W79kj8zg5leGA&p=http%3A%2F%2Ftechnicalchaotic.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F151722949994%2Fthis-is-this-is-me-asking-about-karkat-and-how&m=1)

I feel like Gamkar is a ‘stereotypical’ moirallegiance but in the other direction than murderstuck implied, with Gamzee as the soothing influence on Karkat’s violent temper, and Karkat the fierce defender ( ~~departing from canon here~~ ). Obv they’ll mellow out as they age, Gamzee will find the limits of his temper and learn how to set boundaries, Karkat will eventually internalize the strange idea that he has intrinsic worth, and not need constant reassurance.


	5. Clownkat

**Summary for the Chapter:**

> A longish thread of clownkat musings in various directions

nellynee asked

 

Me, at 3am, instead of sleeping: AU where nothing changes except the Lime class was claimed by the church. The extended zodiac descriptions literally hurt. They are the spiritual where the Purple was the flesh. The GH hates the Rosa for stealing one of his flock and turning him against the church in her ignorance. He hates the Condi for ordering their deaths. She aint never gonna know about this little cancer who what he pulled from the drones. YOU WILL RIP CLOWN!KAT FROM ME WHEN I'M DEAD.

* * *

 

 

> [technicalchaotic](http://technicalchaotic.tumblr.com/post/175530965184/me-at-3am-instead-of-sleeping-au-where-nothing):
>
>> > My darling nerd I would no sooner rip clownKat from you than I would rip him from Gamzee’s loving embrace. give me more of this Good Shit
>>> 
>>> * * *
>>> 
>>>  
>> 
>> I was gonna tag this not my writing but it’s starting to make my brain itch like I could run this to its logical ghbsign end or I could sleep and be a good writer who finishes her wips
>> 
>> Callout post [@nellynee](https://tmblr.co/m8vzcIa0h_Vlacy8knptlRw) for letting their plots breed on my lawn
>> 
>> * * *

[nellynee](http://nellynee.tumblr.com/post/175536728082/me-at-3am-instead-of-sleeping-au-where-nothing):

> Ok but like, no, when I say nothing changes I mean NOTHING CHANGES. (I mean the only thing I’ve found to disprove this is the lime on GH’s wall where there is no purple but EVERYTHING ELSE)
> 
> Because again, I will be ETERNALLY FRUSTRATED that the connection between the limes, Karkat’s mutation to candy red, and the cherub’s blood was one of those dropped threads that permeate Homestuck
> 
> So like, we know that Calliope does permeate a Lord English run universe in small forms (just look at Doc Scratch’s outfit, the limeblood, the painting of faces to show their “true selves”, the ties between the church and theater and her love of stories) She’s THERE in small amounts (not even gonna mention the cufflinks)
> 
> So judging by the timeline and how focused the Condi was on perpetuating the clowns on Earth despite obviously not being one herself, and how the Clowns because a hard troll roll niche before she served English, there’s some emotion here. The GH was probably one of her first and eventually longest troll companions. His entire job is making sure the lowblood’s don’t get uppity, and there’s trust implied there.
> 
> And yeah there’s the occasional not purple clown. But they gotta earn there way in. There’s an olive class that tends to surface pretty heavily in the church who gravitates towards the hunting parties, tends to kill off whoever’s feeding the church best when they do like the place was just being held for them.  A few yellowbloods who’ll wear bees instead of clothing who get in cause it’s one part crazy to two parts hilarious in their inevitable death. Browns who’ll run some impressive animal shows and blues who’ll beat the crap out of themselves with stunts meant more to do harm than avoid it and come out the other end whole and laughing.
> 
> But they aint REALLY clowns, for all that they got the faith of one. They may be circus, but they aint clowns. They aren’t allowed to paint their faces. But someone’s gotta run the rides and stands in the dark carnival, and they know what’s to become of them and believe anyways. Fucking CARNIES, who make sure there’s clothes and food and crap the real entertainers don’t want to fuck with
> 
> But it’s not a hard stretch to imagine a lime or two falling in with a couple of baby clowns when the church it just starting to be a thing.
> 
> (Don’t even get me started also on the Caniborn sign. Derse, Rage, a wavy snake like design with dashes through it that’s SCARY Calliope like, and LIME)
> 
>  And limes are loyal and true and maybe their moodiness is seen more like capriciousness, and the color of their blood ticks off something RIGHT in the GH’s brain and when he goes “That’s OURS” the Condi like… she’s building and empire, fuck, she don’t have any time or attention for lowblood politics anyways, that’s the GH’s biz, so like SURE, if it makes him happy, not like they show up that often anyways. 
> 
> And the Church is a celebration, and the purple’s the flesh. The brother wins in end afterall, and he is said to exalt in the destruction of all. A clown trains as much in song and dance and celebration as much as they do bringing death, for the world is a stage and they endeavor to bring him entertainment in all things. They are the jugglers, the acrobats, the glasswalkers, and ringmasters. Activities meant to awe and maim. 
> 
> But the sister can not be forgotten. Worshiped, no, only a fool worships a god who can not bring you victory, but she must be acknowledged. And she has shown her blessings on these few trolls with her own true flesh, marking them for worship, and the GH delights in their presence. 
> 
> These limes, they KNOW a fucking troll, in ways downright precognitive. Housed with a class meant to main and kill, the limes keep his little flock soothed and in line without prompting. While his clowns go out and fallow the empress’ orders, keeping the lowblood scared and culled down, and the brother happy with the carnage, his limes sit tight, running scandalous shows that delight the sister’s love of all things and the ways a troll can fit with another.
> 
> Lime’s are the BUSKERS. Telling true fortunes with stone and card and star, sleight of hand and magics, contortion and puppeteers. They draw in the crowds and coin in ways his clowns can not. In it’s prime, the circus brought slaves and sacrifices not in shackles, but waited like an open maw for the brave to come and chance the show of a lifetime, taking thrill in the chance of it. Leave with your life, and you may leave with a greater gift still, in memories and futures told and stories to tell.
> 
> (and for all that everyone is trained in the theater and the kill, there is a divide, and balance for the twins, and PROSPERITY)
> 
> And then the Signless comes.
> 
> The GH thinks nothin of it, in the tents, but when he has orders to hunt the upstart down, he knows the fucker true.
> 
> Knows the blunt little teeth and rounded horns of a brother meant to get under the skin. Knows the way the lost and weary are grouping around him. For all there there is not sign upon him nor a face the Grand Highblood could put to one, the troll knows him, calls him by a name he’d thought nearly lost to time and the sea and is not surprised. 
> 
> The Empress’ order are the Empress’ orders, and he turns the boy to her, for all that he wish he could hide him in the fold. For all the rebel is to old to take well to the Church’s brand of love. Execution is not a surprise either, but a hardship the Grandhighblood will not come to enjoy for him, and he stays away. Too, he ignores the rumors of his blood running red, for there is not a fiber within him who would accept rust what he knows to be kin.
> 
> What comes after is worse. 
> 
> HE HATES that fucking daywalking BITCH of a Jade who caused this mess. For all that the boy had no sign she’d given him, he was still family, ripped from their tender arms before he’d even had the chance to know himself, raised not in a hive, but like an animal in the fields and what came from the other side was an abomination. HER ignorance was HIS downfall, and in his grief there is no hurt upon her that seems enough, and for his brother’s life he tasks his empress with bringing the hurt down upon her in his name, and when he surfaces from prayer, he knows not what becomes of her.
> 
> Even calling him friend in one hand, the Empress comes up with her saltlicking shits and desecrate his tents with the other, purging his flock of what she herself deems dangerous, and there’s nothing he can do to stop her.
> 
> He too is a leader, has nipped worse things from his own kind and knows the necessity of paranoia. In the Sweeps that fallowed the one lamb who’d been snatched by the wolf, he’s seen the chaos caused and knows it for it’s awful implications even in it’s beauty. He understands, and the Empress’ ORDERS are the Empress’ fucking ORDERS. 
> 
> (at least she has the fucking decency, to give them dignity. When he scream for order it comes, and the rest die not in fright, but quick and painless and blessed with bowed heads and proper paints, as their patron would have wanted them. They hold no fear for their place in the carnival, but oh he will miss them so)
> 
> (he understands, but he HATES. For his grief holds long and true and EVERMORE, and for all that he loves his eternal Empress, he can not help but fall to aching apathy of her, burned. It is not his humors that keep the water breathers from leaving his space alive, and that is all she’ll get from him for now)
> 
> Time passes, and the church never becomes what it once was again. Without their balance, it’s cruel and dull and lacking something vital. The Empress tries at her apologies, for all she never says the words. Sacrifices for his gods, colonies on planets full of tents and merriment, lessons for his purples back on the homeworld so they come to him smiling and painted. 
> 
> And once, sweeps and sweeps and sweeps later, when he feels so old time stops mattering, he’s surprised. 
> 
> The armada, all of it, sits on Alternia’s swing, and there are more lights upon her when she’s dark than he can ever recollect, but she sits there still, even unchanging. Normally they would not come for this sweeps exiled. They come to the empire. But the Empress’ lusus has done something foolish, and the Empress too sits shivering in her throne from something nearly catastrophic, and she’s still shaking her anger and fear from the nearly of it.
> 
> So the empire is here, and when they pick up the writhing mass of bodies packed together on the moon, sweating and stinking and fighting and loving amongst themselves, he’s there too, watching the waves of color from above for his own enjoyments of the youth of it.  
> 
> Colors are as they do, and tend to group together as they should, and his eyes stray to his first glimpse of his new family, from curiosity of the spectacle more than anything. 
> 
> To far away to see signs or paint, still he knows the curve of some horn and loves the splash of colors and their clothes and the way they already joke among themselves. 
> 
> There are less of them than the other shades, saying their goodbyes, as they know better, keeping their loves and their hates to their own, but some do stand apart, and there, THERE is a horn here knows, for he’s seen it nearly every day, and his laugh booms out over the crowd, loud and shaking and well used, wild enough to cut through the clamor. Eyes turn upon his frame quick like, and their fear oozes up through the air like smoke.
> 
> Eyes turn up to him, and he knows the one who’d been huddled up to his own rare and precious scion. 
> 
> Knows the blunt little teeth and rounded horns of a brother meant to get under the skin. 
> 
> Knows the way the lost and weary are grouping around him in goodbye.
> 
> For all there there is not sign upon him that he can see nor a face the Grand Highblood could put to one, the Grandhighblood knows him, and is surprised. 
> 
> To far away, to far in the clarifying dark of the hold to know actions done in specifics, but his eyes never leave the troll as time passes, and eventually a split is made and direction is set and it’s abundantly clear the specifics of a plan for a troll with no place.
> 
> Ballsy, that, if he’s any good. Imagining that the voice of the Empire might spare him, if he shows himself useful. She would probably have to laws what they are. But the boy would never make it long in the Threshicutioners. 
> 
> He knows his limes, his ones made for the teachings and the people. 
> 
> Assassin he could be, as any who learns to fight, but not happily. And her trust might never be won, knowing what he is. A cold shameful death in the night by his classmates if she’s smart. 
> 
> He puts forth the orders to the Carnies what’s good at pushing these papers and puts his body to work letting the drones know he’ll cull his own failures, as the church always must, and waits for the new lambs to come in.
> 
> (Red. Motherfucking Red. Not rust. Red. He’s the sister’s sure enough, but Blessed by the brother. It’s a sign, that the limes are set to step up again, for the brother is no good without his sister to conquer, and so to the church without it’s love. Meant to LIVE this one, by word of both the gods, and so he shall.)
> 
> (Can you believe this is just the BACKSTORY)
> 
> (By all means, WRITE if you want. This is YET ANOTHER of those things where I have ALL The world building, but can’t OC to save my life, so it dies a horrible, sub written death. I could talk about it for hours, but never actually write it.) 
> 
> * * *

 

[technicalchaotic](http://technicalchaotic.tumblr.com/post/175530965184/me-at-3am-instead-of-sleeping-au-where-nothing):

Holy shit dude.

Like we are taking this in  _opposite fucking directions and I love it_

Bro, friend, nerd of my heart. If you wanna borrow clowns I got your clowns. Your ghb writing is knocking me on my ass, I wanna see where you’re taking this shit.


	6. Additional ClownKat

**Anonymous asked: you should write a fic where karkat ends up, through somehow, in the mirthful messiahs cult!!**

[technicalchaotic](http://technicalchaotic.tumblr.com/post/173307043484/you-should-write-a-fic-where-karkat-ends-up):

> [nellynee](http://nellynee.tumblr.com/post/167046381752/you-should-write-a-fic-where-karkat-ends-up):
>
>> [technicalchaotic](http://technicalchaotic.tumblr.com/post/166967689174/you-should-write-a-fic-where-karkat-ends-up):
>>
>>> Friend, darling, man, my dude, my glorious grayfaced snickerdoodle, 
>>> 
>>> I have like  _three._  
>> 
>> AAAAAH! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! I realize that this is probably actually a case of “Karkat and forced cohabitation with the Clowns” but Clown!Karkat is literally my favorite AU that no one has wrote! It’s so politically interesting it’s not even funny like?!
>> 
>> Do you mind if I ramble off this post? Ignore this if you mind if I ramble but I’m gonna ramble I have many thoughts and feelings about this. (I think I actually wrote some sort of prototype for this once? I have no idea where it ended up on the internet.)
>> 
>> Cause like politically Karkat is in a very precarious position by virtue of his blood. He can either run from the Empire his whole life and hope he’s never found to have it cut short, also potentially cutting himself off from a large portion of his already small pool of friends, or he can attempt conscription at the mercy of the empire and try and win his life by wowing them. And Karkat knows he’s not going to wow them, at the very least on some small subconscious degree. 
>> 
>> And them Gamzee is all “Nah bro come with me when we get conscripted church planet side got all kinds of stories about how fam takes care of it’s own” and at this point I gotta wonder what kind of contacts Gamzee might have? Is his devotion purely from ingesting propaganda? Does he have some other distant contacts with other planet side clowns who are just as clueless as he is to actual adult clown!culture and can sway Karkat? Are adult clowns allowed any sort of contact planet side to officially propagate the religion? How much and in which combination of these does Karkat have to take in to be like “This is so fucking fake and stupid but if I can get some kind of protective cushion before my blood is found out fuck, this actually sounds like a good idea” and like that’s the first sign it’s gonna go horribly wrong is that it actually sounds like a good idea. 
>> 
>> And this is where I go horribly wrong because I have  _the worst preoccupation_ with real life cult indoctrination when applied to a rare blood caste specific religion and “the ends justify the means” mentality to it and I’m not just into it to torture Karkat I swear but actually mixing him in with the clowns with him attempting to pretend to be faithful to literally wedge himself into an appropriate “not murdering him” space in the fleet has no way of not putting him in a vERY BAD PLACE. I just. I Have SO MANY THOUGHTS of horrible, horrible cult indoctrination. And in this case I find the GH’s mentality here far more interesting. 
>> 
>> In any case Threshicutioner!Karkat always makes sense because the Condi always intervenes and has some sort of amused, personal, preoccupation with a loyal Troll of the same bloodline that almost fucked up her whole oppressive system. But lets face it even if it was less impactful at the time it happened, The Signless’ movement is something that made huge ripples down the line that are still being phased out to this day. 
>> 
>> So when his decedent shows up in the church the GH has got a couple of options. Hand him over to be made an example of or do so yourself (something that made enough trouble when it was the troll in question) Kill him quietly like he’s just some wriggler who didn’t make the cut and worry that his line will show up again, since it obviously made it’s way into the slurry (easy, and if there’s any care for Gamzee well the kid’s a Capricorn, he’ll get over it with time, or he wont, either way… But that does seem a lot less fun) or keep the kid, which is RISKY TO ALL HELL but as more time passes just becomes REALLY FUCKING FUNNY
>> 
>> So you’ve got Karkat, who’s trying to desperately pretend he’s got some kind of faith to save his own hide, and becoming gradually less and less able to hide his disdain when a combination of him being unable to keep up the performance, his unsavory blood color leaving him out of the loop of “family” and his treatment through indoctrination becoming worse leaving his own outlook for survival becoming smaller and he starts sassing back because he can’t keep his mouth shut and he’s angry. Hes fucking pissed because you can’t be super nice one minute and then pure fucking evil the next clowns are fucking confusing. 
>> 
>> And Gamzee, who’s so sure in the importance of quadrants and who’s getting treated well in comparison because he’s the right color and he’s faithful and has complete and utter faith in the necessarily evil of it all and keeps living in the future when it’s all over and everything is better even as he tries to fight for his moiral’s life the only way he can think to
>> 
>> And the GH, who in this case probably touched a Dream Bubble or two in his time and now thinks every hallucination and revelation and dream and anything he can’t explain is divine intervention, and he probably has some dream that he interprets as favoritism towards Karkat by the gods. So like, FUCK, now he’s got to actually try at indoctrinating the fucking heretical idiot this SUCKS. But the idea of the descendant of a rival religious faction that can’t seem to be stomped out singing the messiah’s praises is FUCKING HILARIOUS and the more Karkat spits and hisses the funnier it becomes until the very thought of sticking this boy painted all pretty in front of Meenah and watching the look on her face sends him into a tizzy every time he thinks about it and the GH get WAY TO INVESTED in the eventual success of converting Karkat. 
>> 
>> And it’s literally none of the propaganda or horrible mindfuckery or just getting so tired that does it in the end no. In the end when he’s so tired and sore and hungry and empty inside in this dark and damp and rank as fuck place, when he’s so sure he’s gonna die, Karkat sleeps, and for a very long time he has a conversation with a stranger in a dark hood, with green skin and black eyes who sits at the end of the spiral, and when he wakes up what he’s seen matches so much fucking stuff in this stupid religion that he’s not even supposed to know that he really has no fucking choice right? like it’s so ridiculous they were actually right all along Karkat is going to effing scream!??? Not to mention how many of the elder Clowns are freaked the fuck out by how much the wriggler learned in his sleep this has got to be some kind of sign?!?! The GH hadn’t actually believed he had favoritism till now like Fuck? FUCK?!?!  (Side note I hate the lack of narrative fallow through on Karkat’s blood color, the insinuation that he would have been lime without the mutation, and that his two possible hues are a match for those of the species that the cult worships. There had to be some kind of universal constant in there between Alternia and Sgrub and the connection is never brought up)
>> 
>> AKA that fic I casually plan a lot but will never write exclusively because I’m bad at fantrolls.
> 
> Wait wait what the fuck when did this happen _I LOVE THIS_

(Never mind the fact that I’ve been systematically pulling apart game mechanics and universal Homestuck constants to try and put Gamzee on Earth C with the rest of the kids to make myself feel better about the ending nooooo (I did it by the way!))

But also like, don’t even get me started on Universal constants and fallow through. Because remaining in the Alternia universe, we now have the Alternian constants to worry about, like, idk, narrative continuations of you’re ancestor’s stories? And we saw what kind of hubbabloo Kankri got up to with just some barely awakened Seer powers and forming his own bonds.

Because BOY HOWDY there is a very strong trend of family and tight knitted community in the juggalo’s from fandom, and just imagine the kind of JUGGERNAIT they could become with an adult knight of blood just starting to tap into his potential.


End file.
